chapter Guyver April 2013

[*Jess♥]

Uranus guided humans to turn into zoanoids and zoalords. would it not be unusual to assume Archanfel isn't basically human at his core?

[Cannibal]

Uncleaned Japanese scan: http://www.mediafire.com/?btabm14tggb2xec

[daveblackeye152]

There we go I can see that one. Okay I figured after getting the house spoiled, hey I just had to know even without seeing the issue, that nothing would surprise me. I was wrong, a little disappointed that minotaur was just Apollyon disguised but certainly a surprise. The other one is that Archanfel is sleeping in that house.

[Cannibal]

Spoiler pic: http://s018.radikal.ru/i502/1302/c9/9ade909c655f.jpg

[Bio-Boosted Dude]

Hahahahaha that is great Cannibal!

 

Also I think the idea of Imakarum collecting the crystals to heal Archanfel interesting - I'm sure he knows that the Gigantic was designed as a Zoalord killer so that explains why he kidnapped the siblings. 

 

I wonder if Apollon revealed himself as Imakarum to the Segawas whether that would help or hinder whatever he has up their sleeves. On the one hand, it's a familiar face, but on the other, they know he is no longer Murakami.

[river_chaos]

Hey, guys, I just remembered something while looking back in vol. 11.  Imakarum has always remembered his life as Murakami, so in a sense he's not regaining memories but more like his original personality.  I'm guessing after the battle with Gigantic Dark when he got his Zoacrystal broken, part of the Imakarum persona broke and Murakami started to resurface little by little. 

[Raius]

My only question is, if it is Imakarum, how did he get the armor? If it's the same material as the Guyver Control Medels, how did he get so much of it? Are the Creators still a factor or does Chronos have stashes of this metal hidden somewhere that Balcus doesn't know about?

[BlasterTempest]

the Murakami personality "return" is the only thing that makes sense, but the Imakarum persona has shown no signs of slipping since he got dusted by Agito, no?

 

also: where would he get such badass armour?

[*V Guyver]

I'm more curious about his abilities. We know Imakirum has his old abilities, and Guyots, and they are stronger than before too. But know he can mimic other abilities, that's a Power only Alky is supposed to have. 

Also, lol at that nice edit Cannibal made.

As for reproductive organs. All Zoanoids and Zoalords have them, the creators made them with the intention of reproducing to breed, evolve, and replenish their army ranks. Also, when they talk about Lost Numbers losing being unable to reproduce, they aren't talking about the sexual function, but instead, replicating their battle form. You people don't think Aptom can just... you know...? Grow one? 

[Salkafar]

I'm more curious about his abilities. We know Imakirum has his old abilities, and Guyots, and they are stronger than before too. But know he can mimic other abilities, that's a Power only Alky is supposed to have. 

Also, lol at that nice edit Cannibal made.

As for reproductive organs. All Zoanoids and Zoalords have them, the creators made them with the intention of reproducing to breed, evolve, and replenish their army ranks. Also, when they talk about Lost Numbers losing being unable to reproduce, they aren't talking about the sexual function, but instead, replicating their battle form. You people don't think Aptom can just... you know...? Grow one? 

 

1) Maybe the mimicking ability is a function of the armor, not a power of the wearer.

2) We don't know that all Zoalords have reproductive organs. We don't, in fact, know that ANY of them do. Zoalords are selected, not bred, and why would immortal beings need to reproduce?

[*Jess♥]

the term lost number refers to a zoanoid that is lost to future generations.

remember that the plan was to take successive generations into space. therefore a zoanoid who is sterile is useless. after all, why would they be butthurt about a zoanoid that was merely unique? surely they would prize that one above others? not shun it. like hypers.

 

anyway, the human form of a zoanoid is generally unchanged. we see all aspects of them the same as previous. it doesn't make any sense to think their genitals shrunk into a blank spot. whether they be lost number, normal zoanoid, hyper, or even zoalord.  just sayin'.

 

oh yeah, archanfel has pointy ears... so i think the best we could assume is a change of his jewels into more pointy jewels.

[*Jess♥]

2) We don't know that all Zoalords have reproductive organs. We don't, in fact, know that ANY of them do. Zoalords are selected, not bred, and why would immortal beings need to reproduce?

extreme language and themes....

sorry about the video quality...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbuU3dPKua0

[Salkafar]

"it doesn't make any sense to think their genitals shrunk into a blank spot. whether they be lost number, normal zoanoid, hyper, or even zoalord.  just sayin'."

 

I do not agree. "it doesn't make any sense". In the case of the Zoalords it does. They are ageless. They don't need their genitals. They might even be a hindrance. And Archanfel was never meant to reproduce. He is unique.

[*Jess♥]

I respect your reasoning, but I am just thinking in terms of what we have been shown so far. I mean out of everything we have seen, it doesn't  make sense to me for something like that to be true, when we have not been given any indication of it.

Also, we see that Archanfel has navel. and hair. We haven't seen any instances of things that are 'not needed' being removed from the human form. all instances of processing show an altered form and the original human form. hence why Aptom still has his scar. right?

 

I mean... i don't think it makes sense to assume that, when we haven't been shown anything that suggests it? Unless we have, and i'm forgetting?

[durendal]

Wow, quite a surprise, we were discussing a guyver chapter and now we are discussing genitals?  What has the world come to?

[Salkafar]

I respect your reasoning, but I am just thinking in terms of what we have been shown so far. I mean out of everything we have seen, it doesn't  make sense to me for something like that to be true, when we have not been given any indication of it.

Also, we see that Archanfel has navel. and hair. We haven't seen any instances of things that are 'not needed' being removed from the human form. all instances of processing show an altered form and the original human form. hence why Aptom still has his scar. right?

 

I mean... i don't think it makes sense to assume that, when we haven't been shown anything that suggests it? Unless we have, and i'm forgetting?

 

We have seen him (and other Zoalords) naked and they had no indication of genitals. They looked like mannequins down there.

 

If that doesn't suggest 'no genitals' I don't know what would.

[*Jess♥]

yes you are right of course. but then... I think most of us assumed that was an artistic choice to maintain this as a shonen manga. but you are correct of course. taking it literally we would be more accurate to assume no genitals.  I can't argue with that

[*Kenji Murakami]

Pretty much everyone we've seen naked in the manga hasn't been shown with genetaila; it seems like more of an artsyle thing than anything else. To me, anyway.

[*V Guyver]

 Well, we do know that Zoanoids crossbred with humans in the past. So that is my understanding as to why they all have genitals and depicted lack of them in the manga is due to artistic and Japanese laws. Though you are right, Salkafar, in that since there is a lack of actual appearance of the, we can't back it up as a fact, however, you can understand the basic reasoning as to why they likely have them.

 Chronos would like nothing more than to have as many Zoanoids as possible, and removing their ability to reproduce would of course limit that goal, not to mention cause serious problems in the event of a war, such as targeting none Zoanoid populations in order to bring the species into extinction, if you build a strategy around killing base humans and avoiding combat with Zoanoid units, you pretty much have a fast win. It's the same principal as targeting supplies. Wipe those out and your army can't feed. resupply, or replace units. If the Advents with all their brilliant thought for war, would overlook something that simple in billions of years, than they deserve to get wiped out by Humanity! 

[Salkafar]

But I'm not talking about Zoanoids. We already know their battleforms have no genitals, and why would they? Anything that makes you vulnerable would be obsolete. But they are cannon fodder, supposed to breed rapidly (I wonder: do Zoaformed women perhaps have shorter pregnancies, and a higher rate of twins, triplets, quadruplets? Do Zoanoids breed in litters?) and lead short, violent lives. Zoalords, on the other hand, are immortal - and Archanfel was unique. Does that mean he has no genitals?  Of course not, he was after all made from human stock, even if he is far beyond it. But it would not surprise me if he is physically asexual, just for the symbolic value.

[river_chaos]

First off, how the hell did we get on the topic of Zoalords and their jewels?

 

Second, it would seem rather dumb to not have Zoalords that could reproduce.  They're supposedly special geneticlly along with their acquired traits, hence very few can undergo the process of Zoalord optimization, right? Wouldn't they reproduce so there would be more humans that could undergo the process incase the Zoalords were killed?

[LordSpleach]

Well, I think it's an artistic choice with the lack of genitals instead of plot-related, because of the three females that have been depicted nude, they didn't have drawn out female genitalia as well. Also, I completely forgot the Segawas have yet to see

the human face of Archanfel. They think he was kidnapped too........

[Salkafar]

First off, how the hell did we get on the topic of Zoalords and their jewels?

 

Second, it would seem rather dumb to not have Zoalords that could reproduce.  They're supposedly special geneticlly along with their acquired traits, hence very few can undergo the process of Zoalord optimization, right? Wouldn't they reproduce so there would be more humans that could undergo the process incase the Zoalords were killed?

 

Um... no, we don't know any such thing. We do know it took Barcas about 400 years to find ten individuals who were suitable, at least one of whom wasn't even human to begin with. But Barcas wasn't chosen for his genetic code - otherwise it would have been rather a huge coincidence. If anything, Chronos selects their warriors based on their personality... after all, Lisker was not a Zoanoid and yet he was devoted to the organization.

 

Imagine someone with extremely suitable genes... but with the personality of a lichen. No! You want accomplished soldiers, men (but not, it seems, women) who can perform optimally in a combat situation, yet at the same time remain capable of believing in the higher ideal that Chronos is.

 

Love Aptom or hate him, he is no soldier. Love Zektoll or hate him, but he was.

[Guyver0]

In terms of the lack of genital display in the Manga series I believe it to be more of an artistic choice.  I mean very early in the series we have seen depictions of Sho more or less being in the nude without a drawing indicating that he has genitals and for what reason would Yoshiki Takaya depict Sho as a regular human without genitals?  Plus how many other Manga series out there share that same artistic depiction for their male characters?

 

As for the Zoalords, Salkafar is right the Zoalords are chosen for their personal qualities and not for being genetically applicable to the Zoalord process.  However with Archenfel I am not sure.  I mean yeah he is human based, but at the same time he has an elvin appearance and cat like eyes when he is normal so we can't say for certain that he is more human than anything else.  Kind of like Waferdonos who wasn't human at all.

[river_chaos]

Apparently Barcas got rusty in the selection department when it came down to Guyot and Kurrugmenic being optimized.