How easily are you Offended

[durendal]

With the digital age, everybody can now be easily heard.  Now that social media is the norm, everybody can freely express themselves.  But is this a good thing?  The ease of communicating also brought about lesser inhibition.  Introverts are now a thing of the past.  People now are easier to offend.

I wonder how this came about.  Were people really easy to offend to begin with and was just amplified by the digital age?  Or was it because the boom of the internet failed to prepare the emotional state of a person?  Did parents then fail to realize the effect of leaving their children to the internet that paved the way to those kids growing up to be emotionally fragile?  What happened to us?

I remember a time when people would call me names and I would just laugh it off.  Now you call that bullying.  If you do something out of good will but others see it differently, you get lambasted for it.  

That's why I stay away from all forms of social media.  It's too damn tiring to squabble when you can do something much more productive.

[H222G981]

On 10/30/2020 at 8:09 PM, durendal said:

People now are easier to offend.

That's true. A lot of people are easily offended. Sometimes you don't have to try. Just look at these women. They're called Karens. They get mad over nothing! and you deal with them on Online games, in public, and on forums. Karens are everywhere. Then you have people that you can't get along with period. It doesn't matter what you say. If someone can't stand me. Then anything that I say is a damned if I do and damned if I don't circumstance.  

 

Edited April 7, 2021 by Mr. Dawn
Reworded my post.

[Salkafar]

[Tora Tan]

It really depends. if somebody says something that is not true and it is well known that it is not true, then there is no threat to me.
on the other hand, if I think there is a chance people will believe it and through believing it, will potentially cause harm to me, then I will be offended and I will fight to restore my honour.

for example, if I am in a room at a job interview, and somebody says "that girl is a slut", then that will offend me far more, since there is a chance the interviewers might believe it and I will lose the interview.  But if I am on the street an a random stranger calls me a slut,  I just assume they have some personal issue they need to work through and ignore them.

The internet can amplify this. if somebody says something that might be harmful against a sub culture that is already  under attack, well if it goes unchallenged, then the zeitgeist can move to a state where this subculture can be in an even worse off position in law and society.
In this day and age, and individual's words can be far more damaging than they may have been in the past, before social media. these echo chambers can amplify a message and this can turn into a war of words or a war of concepts.

Edited November 1, 2020 by Tora Tan

[durendal]

On 11/1/2020 at 9:51 AM, Tora Tan said:

The internet can amplify this. if somebody says something that might be harmful against a sub culture that is already  under attack, well if it goes unchallenged, then the zeitgeist can move to a state where this subculture can be in an even worse off position in law and society.
In this day and age, and individual's words can be far more damaging than they may have been in the past, before social media. these echo chambers can amplify a message and this can turn into a war of words or a war of concepts.

 

Yes, that's what I'm talking about.  Because of the internet, people can have a conversation with anybody without being shy.  Eliminating a face to face discussion puts less pressure on people to communicate properly, more often, saying things without inhibition.  Like what Salkafar has quoted, people now eliminates the possibility that they will get punched for disrespecting people.

I also don't get why it is so easy to disrespect people.  I understand that when you are angry, you say hurtful things.  This is caused by an emotional response.  But does that mean that most everyone online are angry all the time?  Well, that's what it looked like to me.

[Tora Tan]

I think they probably are.
People are angry from their day job, they are stressed and ready to explode all the time, they turn cruel. I myself can turn cruel on very rare occasions, if I am in a really bad way.
There is a mental health crisis in many countries.

[H222G981]

On 11/6/2020 at 8:49 AM, Tora Tan said:

People are angry from their day job, they are stressed and ready to explode all the time, they turn cruel. I myself can turn cruel on very rare occasions, if I am in a really bad way.
 

My marriage turned me into a bitter person. My ex wife and my in-laws convinced me that I was unstable and that I was crazy.  I went to see councilors and therapists. Eventually my therapist became convinced that it was my marriage that was the problem. He became convinced that I didn't need the medication anymore either. He even suggested marital counseling before. However when I told my therapist about my wife cheating on me and us living in the same apartment. He noticed I was at my limit. So 3 months after the divorce was finalized. I quit taking my medication. I only agreed to seek help for myself and take medication because I thought it was save a toxic marriage. It was pointless now. No point. Now today, in the present. I feel 100% better. I know now that I don't have drama and a screaming fight between me and a woman waiting for me when I get home. I know I can rest and do what I want. 

[durendal]

6 hours ago, Jupiter said:

My marriage turned me into a bitter person. My ex wife and my in-laws convinced me that I was unstable and that I was crazy.  I went to see councilors and therapists. Eventually my therapist became convinced that it was my marriage that was the problem. He became convinced that I didn't need the medication anymore either. He even suggested marital counseling before. However when I told my therapist about my wife cheating on me and us living in the same apartment. He noticed I was at my limit. So 3 months after the divorce was finalized. I quit taking my medication. I only agreed to seek help for myself and take medication because I thought it was save a toxic marriage. It was pointless now. No point. Now today, in the present. I feel 100% better. I know now that I don't have drama and a screaming fight between me and a woman waiting for me when I get home. I know I can rest and do what I want. 

You see, that's just the thing.  You mention you were a bitter person, but none of us think that you were (presuming everyone agrees).  Years into this board and I haven't seen you being toxic.  In fact, instead of lashing out, you reached out.  It just the way how people handle themselves.  Some may be nice, prim and proper offline, but when they get online, they suddenly turn into trolls.  It's like how a mild mannered person could turn into a road maniac when they are behind a steering wheel.  Though I am guilty of that sometimes, but that usually happens when intensely provoked.   This quote, which I'm not sure if it was really Keanu Reeves who said it, but it resonates with me:

Quote

I'm at that stage of my life where I keep myself out of arguments.  Even if you tell me 1+1=5, you're absolutely correct, enjoy.

I can't say that it's an age thing, as I also see people who are older than me that says the damnedest things.  Could it be that people now are much more opinionated, that they malign anyone who simply disagrees with them?  I get how heated debates can become, but to the point of insulting?  

[*Jess♥]

15 hours ago, durendal said:

You see, that's just the thing.  You mention you were a bitter person, but none of us think that you were (presuming everyone agrees).  Years into this board and I haven't seen you being toxic.  In fact, instead of lashing out, you reached out.  It just the way how people handle themselves.  Some may be nice, prim and proper offline, but when they get online, they suddenly turn into trolls. 

from the very beginning, my philosophy with this forum was to ensure everyone was listened to and respected.
Jupiter, I can't recall too well, but I remember when you first came here, there must have been a reason why I started talking to you via pm? do you think you were disruptive back then? or was there another reason?
in any case, there has been a number of VERY disruptive and toxic people in the history of the forum, but with every single case, I took the effort to talk to them, to understand why they were behaving that way and try and help them to be nicer to others.
I think I only failed one time.  I remember that clearly.. their name and avatar was something to do with tropical fruit? or hawaii?  it's hard to remember.
 

[Guyver1]

Offense is truly subjective. Emotions are as well. We all have the right to live as we like. Barring hurting others, stealing, killing, or sad to even have to say, harming children. As we all have that right, others have a right to disagree. The issue is not in disagreement,  but with the thought process of feeling the need to voice or act upon it. The truly boring care what others do as they have nothing to focus on (apparently) in their own lives. Then, on the opposite side people feel the need to rub in the face of society their beliefs or lifestyles. All this division is merely distraction. Distraction from leading your own life and being happy. My view, as small as it admittedly is... is that I don't really care what others do or say. To care one way or another is to accept their beliefs or give credence to their nonsense. The day will hopefully come when we can all agree that it doesn't matter. Offense, preaching, philosophizing... everyone be good to everyone. The ones you can't be good to, steer clear of. Life's too short to be spent worrying about the vast majority of people you will never know, their opinions or anything else.

 

Wait... what happened? What I meant to say was Guyver is awesome and I cant wait for it to come back!! 

[H222G981]

On 11/13/2020 at 10:18 AM, Jess♥ said:

Jupiter, I can't recall too well, but I remember when you first came here, there must have been a reason why I started talking to you via pm? do you think you were disruptive back then? or was there another reason?
 

 At the time I was desperate to have someone that I could talk to. I took you as someone I could talk to, and I don't regret it at all. It was one of the best decisions I made. I was having some marital issues even then, as well as the marriage was taking it's toll on me.  It was making me mentally unstable. Talking to you really helped me get through some of it.

But years later. It all got worse. After filing for divorce and it becoming final and moving on in life. I'm stronger mentally and emotionally now. I realize now that I really was with a manipulative and toxic woman that just used me up.  However, what worries me now is. I don't know if I have the strength to be in a relationship. Sure, I'd love to be with someone. But after awhile, it seems like every woman I've been with just wears me down eventually and the relationship just goes downhill from there. 

Edited November 16, 2020 by Jupiter

[durendal]

Well, speaking of being easily offended, cancel culture seems to be a prevalent norm nowadays just because one does not agree with the general public.  This is most evident when a celebrity speaks their mind that offends a lot of people.  In relation to this, I've seen Rowan Atkinson gave a speech and he made some fine points about this.  Although his speech is about a law being passed in the UK, the contents of what he said still rings true in a lot of ways.

 

 

Edited March 9, 2021 by durendal

[Tora Tan]

It's a difficult one, because while it certainly seems reasonable what Mr Atkinson is saying,  There is also the other side of the issue.
I mean the part about tolerance and intolerance.
For tolerance to be a thing, we have to be intolerant of intolerant rhetoric. it's a double ended sword sort of thing.
If you are tolerant of hate speech for example, you end up with a lot of hateful rhetoric throughout society...
this kind of 'free speech' can be very emotionally damaging to people on the receiving end.
Mental health has been pushed aside for a very long time.  It's time we put more of a focus on how our words can effect others. as the phrase goes, "the pen is truly mightier than the sword".  The use of language can be incredibly powerful.

We only need to look at what has been happening in the US. The irresponsible use of free speech led to an attack on the capitol building.

I actually don't think This really relates to cancel culture though. I mean... cancel culture is more about joining in on a echo chamber like phenomenon, or jumping on the bandwagon.
people are feeling the need to belong to some cause or group.  This isn't related to free speech, it's related to our lack of social connection.
A person could say anything they want, but if one particularly influential person decides that it's not okay, they can weaponise language in such a way that creates this cancel effect. it's not really about tolerance or intolerance. it's about wanting to be part of a tribe.

Edited March 9, 2021 by Tora Tan
typo

[durendal]

Well, I'm certainly no expert on cancel culture, and you are right that free speech is a double edge sword.  It goes both ways.  However, the negative impact is greatly amplified by social media.    I believe that free speech should not be restricted, but should be brandished responsibly by those with influence.  What happened in the US capitol riot was an act of idiocy hiding behind the pretext of free speech.  If Trump was an ordinary citizen then, what he said should be fine.  But he was the President of the United States and the words that comes out of his mouth carries a certain weight.  As what someone's uncle always said, "with great power comes great responsibility".  What he did was irresponsible.  It's practically him saying "come into my house (the capitol) and do (ransack) whatever you want".  Do you think this would have happened if an ordinary citizen was up in that podium spewing the same lines that Trump was saying.  Most likely, a lot of people would deem him a lunatic.

The concept of free speech was to empower those who are powerless, and not to be used by those in power to incite.   But you do have a point about hate speech.  Again, this needs to be handled responsibly.   I'll give a perfect example.  I'm Asian and with a lot of hate crimes being committed to Asians right now I should be heavily affected by this.   If you berate me to my face, I can accept that because we are talking on equal grounds.  I can choose to ignore you or I can punch you in the face.  That's freedom of speech.  However, if you do that on social media with the power to amplify those words from others, then we are no longer on equal grounds and what you have done is trampled on my rights.  There is also no way for me to react to this, thus, restricting me of my freedom.  That is not free speech.

But hate speech originates from misguided information, and may have been influenced on how a person grew up.  Given a chance, it is possible to correct all of this with the proper education.

The world is so screwed up right now and I miss the simpler times before the internet.

[Tora Tan]

I would say we agree with our sentiments, but our use of language is different. I think when we use the term 'free speech' we are thinking about it in a different way.
for example, you mentioned social media amplifying a message and said that is not free speech. in my own concept of it, that would qualify as free speech. so from that, I understand where you are coming from better. from this basis, I agree with you whole heartedly, free speech is important.
you brought up the fact you are asian and that brought to mind the situation in hong kong. Their free speech has been taken from them and that is awful.

that kind of freedom of expression is very important.

I also find it interesting what you say about responsibility. I believe that this is essential. should this not be enshrined in law in some way? because we can say that leaders should be responsible, but many influencers are not responsible and there is nothing we can do about it. I think this may be why cancel culture could be a good thing. JK Rowling is being cancelled by a lot of people now, because she is a major influencer and she is using that platform to attack LGBT people.
well, I am sure that she has a right to voice her opinion, but at what point does that become hate speech?

maybe Mr Atkinson is right? maybe this conversation should play out? Maybe in so doing, people can show JKR how she is wrong?

[durendal]

I think there needs to be a distinction between Free speech and Bullying.  A lot of the negative actions in the present all have the same denominator.  Bullying.  Many people have the mentality of "I don't like what you said so I'll rally some folks and shame you".  I may be wrong but that is how I see cancel culture.  Lambasting a person whether the intentions are good or bad, it's still a form of bullying.  You commit one mistake and you are branded for life.  And because of that mistake, your mental health takes a toll.  I don't know if people are much harsher now or are much weaker mentally.

[Tora Tan]

That does sound about right.
I can't imagine what it must be like to be the target of cancel culture or a mass movement like that, but I have been pounced on in other forums due to the echo chamber effect.  I am not very good at 'reading the room' to be honest, and I might say something with good intentions and it feels like everyone has turned to face me and is now sending vicious barbs in my direction. it is a horrible experience when nobody wants to listen, they just want to attack.  It can start with one post and then it can snowball and I find myself turned into some kind of strawman for all their vitriol.  It doesn't help that I have a fragile ego resulting from childhood abuse. I can't walk away, I have to defend my character.

[H222G981]

Quote

 I can't walk away, I have to defend my character.

Sometimes no matter how hard you try to defend your own person. People have already made up their mind about you. In their mind and their perspective. You're the bad guy no matter what you say or do. There's nothing you can do to change that. It's called a witch hunt where someone or some people are going to hate on you regardless of how good your argument is. They're not open to seeing things from your point of view. 

 

 

[Time War Dalek Emperor]

I spent so much of my younger life being bullied or treated as mentally backwards that I've got skin that that would put solid steel to shame these days. It was either go insane or deal with it, and little me dealt with it. I really don't give a toss what people say about me or think in their little, narrow minds. 

Thats not to say I'm impregnable though, no matter how strong you are we all have our limits.

Usually I get more annoyed by people saying things about those I care about then myself.

On the subject of free speech, I feel we all have the right say what we and be judged by what we say. If your spouting garbage fine, just be prepared for people think garbage of you.  

[durendal]

8 hours ago, The Tremas Master said:

On the subject of free speech, I feel we all have the right say what we and be judged by what we say. If your spouting garbage fine, just be prepared for people think garbage of you.  

 

But then, that "garbage" is still subjective as a lot of people become more opinionated, how people react to what you say depends on how positive or negative they are to the subject.  Noble intentions are not always reciprocated nobly, and often times being scorned because of different beliefs.  And because of the spread of misinformation, a lot of people become unwitting accomplices in spreading fake news as they themselves believe those news to be true.  

And to be passionate about any subject matter, can cause an inherent emotional response to attack a speaker because of a defense mechanism.  This is so evident in social media today that it's scary.

[Time War Dalek Emperor]

4 hours ago, durendal said:

 

But then, that "garbage" is still subjective as a lot of people become more opinionated, how people react to what you say depends on how positive or negative they are to the subject.  Noble intentions are not always reciprocated nobly, and often times being scorned because of different beliefs.  And because of the spread of misinformation, a lot of people become unwitting accomplices in spreading fake news as they themselves believe those news to be true.  

And to be passionate about any subject matter, can cause an inherent emotional response to attack a speaker because of a defense mechanism.  This is so evident in social media today that it's scary.

All good points.

I only speak from my perspective of the subject, and it’s that simple to me. I am myself at all time and I treat others respectfully and respect some bare minimum respect in turn. But then my view point is one far more open minded and understand to others. How that philosophy mesh’s with others is taken on a case by case basis. 

Perhaps at my core I don’t need others to agree with me or care what they think. That said I’m well aware that their are plenty of people who spend their time doing the reverse.

of course the other issue in it all is when you apply restrictions, we’re do you stop? How do you know your restrictions are the right ones beyond what you feel? Worst of all how do you stop them being abused, even by yourself and don’t forget that just because you brought them in, dose not mean your the one befitting from them in the end. 
 

I personally prefer an imperfect, adaptable system then a hardline one. 
 

Im not suggesting that’s what your advocating for mind you. I just use it as an example to explain my thought process.

 

 

Edited May 24, 2022 by The Tremas Master
Reasons

[ALASTOR]

How easily are you Offended?

It depends.

- If I don't care about the person and the relationship between us, than: I don't care. Like Keanu Reeves

- If I care about the person and our relationship, than I ask: Why is he angry? What have I done? Where? How?... Till I clarify the problem. Many times people create a fantasy, which is totally wrong.