Guyver Bonding

[Spartan Warlord]

is it possible for a G-Unit to bond to a animal...i mean what is it that makes the Unit only bond with a human...chimps dna is only 2% different than ours *thanks for the info*...wats to stop the unit bonding to a chimp??

[McAvoy]

Possibly the brain. Since the control medal directly links to the brain, it could only be guessed that the unit will at first bond with the chimp and during the merging process, 'feel out' the brain' and then disengage if it's too small or unsat.

That's my theory.

[Shenzon]

Possibly the brain. Since the control medal directly links to the brain, it could only be guessed that the unit will at first bond with the chimp and during the merging process, 'feel out' the brain' and then disengage if it's too small or unsat.

That's my theory.

That's also what I've always thought. But then I wondered if I was wrong, what would a tiger look like or even act like bonded with a unit.

[Spartan Warlord]

lol...i was just thinking about because there arent any clear guild lines to what to what it can and cannot bond 2

[W'Kar]

Considering only three have been shown in the story they never exactly had to touch on such things.

My assumption would be that it would bond to anything capable of utilizing it. Whether a tiger, dog, or even a goldfish can I couldn't tell you.

[Juggernought]

Or perhaps it has a way of scanning a possible host's brain to see if he/she is acceptable and able to utilize it fully. In the many ways we see or read of a person bonding with a unit the cm glowed for a bit and then activated a moment later. Perhaps in those few seconds it quickly analysed the host.

[*zeo]

Possibly, but Unit's are activated with a switch on the bottom of the unit.

Which in turns releases the organism from stasis. Then the case opens up and dissolves and the organism with the CM in the center launches itself at the nearest host within line of the direction the dormant unit was facing when activated.

The thing to remember is the organism doesn't care what it bonds to. It is a parasitic life form that literally absorbs other life forms and then mimics them.

The only thing to keep it in check is the Control Medal.

So it could be glowing in response to a potential host or it could be just preparing to stop the organism from completely devouring the host and manipulating it to instead bond with the host.

I personally believe the later.

In which case the unit will bond to any life form, with the possible exception that it has a brain to link to.

But since this has never been tested in any version of the Guyver we are left to speculate.

[Guyver0]

The units should be able to merge with any sentient being as long as it can "feed" off of the organisms energy, so a brain in the human understanding may not be needed.

The reason why I think a "brain" isn't needed is because we don't know the anatomy of the creators, for all we know they could be like a cell and have a nucleus that acts as a brain.

That's what I think anyways.

[BloodStorm]

Well, it's not cannon by any means.. but in my Bloodstorm fictions, a Tiger bonded with a guyver unit. I can't tell you any of the phsycics behind it, as at the time I wrote that character I was less concerned with how things worked and more concerned about nifty fight scenes.. aaaanyway.

My theory is that a guyver animal still acts like a normal animal for the most part, they just have a habit of living longer than their normal kin, so that they would experiance more, and allow instinct to adapt over time, since it could live through mistakes it would never manage on it's own. Thus after a couple centuries it would be comparable to early man as far as what it can and can't figure out.

Thats how I'ld handle a guyver animal.. but since I'm not in charge of such things, if it happened in the manga (and that's a big IF) then who knows what would happen. In the end, this is probobly one of those things we'll never get a definitive answer from the source about.

[*zeo]

That would still be a brain, which is required for the CM interface if nothing else.

[sonarelite]

If I'm right I think I remember reading somewere in the manga stories that the creators were just a bunch metal orbs, before they ran the guyver zero test and found a way to give themselves human form afterwards.

zeo said

That would still be a brain, which is required for the CM interface if nothing else.

now if the above quote is right then how would the original creators being metal orbs have interfaced with a control medal having no brain to interface with.

please explain this.

[guyverfanatic]

If I'm right I think I remember reading somewere in the manga stories that the creators were just a bunch metal orbs, before they ran the guyver zero test and found a way to give themselves human form afterwards.

zeo said

That would still be a brain, which is required for the CM interface if nothing else.

now if the above quote is right then how would the original creators being metal orbs have interfaced with a control medal having no brain to interface with.

please explain this.

The creators use the bio-booster armor in order to interact with the physical world since they do not possess phyical bodies. They evolved to the point where they no longer needed a physical body, so that is why they use the armor.

[*zeo]

The Metal Orbs are the representation of the Control Medals, not the Creators. Often times the Creators only interacted with their creations mentally and since they wore units all that was seen was a mental impression of the CM.

We were never shown the creators natural forms and we do not know what they looked like.

The idea that they are some sort of ascended beings is pure speculation, which I disagree with since the Manga clearly stated they had 1/10th the power of a Guyver with the Unit and that could only be if they had a physical form for the unit to Bio-Boost.

[Thunder Demon1472669266]

Well, I think it's safe to say, as long as there is a brain that is capable of some form of coherent thought (that is, is it in some way similar to the functionality of a human brain?), then it is likely to bond just fine. So, that is to say, an intelligent being could utilize the Unit. Then comes the question, what would an intelligent being be capable of?

From what I've heard, read, and learned, it's not just bipedal animals that are intelligent (c'mon, we've done plenty of studies on gorillas, chimps, apes in general, to understand that they do in fact communicate, can remember, and can speak intelligently with ASL, that's American Sign Language for those who don't know). I have been told plenty of times that dolphins are just as smart or smarter even, than a human. If this is the case, based on the "brain factor" let's call it, then a dolphin should be perfectly capable of using a Unit. However, it is unlikely that there would be one, floating out in the middle of the ocean, waiting to be poked by a dolphin. The Units do weigh a fair bit on their own from everything that I can tell, meaning they would sink in H20. But, it sounds like that the Creators did some test work on other animals with Unit. Wouldn't that also come into play here as well?

We do know that the Units gave the Creators a humanoid form. But, this doesn't mean they were humanoid, or even bipedal to begin with. They could be something vaguely like a rat. But, I'd imagine that when they created the human race, that they wanted something that looked similar to how they do in true form, which then implies that they are indeed bipedal. This "Creator Form" idea, is interesting. I'll get back to it later.

When you create something, you want it to be able to be used by beings similar to your race, or of your race ideally, so humankind as a whole, Canis lupus familiaris is another. To continue using Earth examples, something that a Man creates could very well be in use by say, a chimp or other great ape. But, it would be difficult for say a dog to use a TV, now wouldn't it? Based on this "Similarity Concept", something that is made for a particular race is made usually solely for that race's operation and usage. In some cases, it can be used by another race, that is similar. As stated, it isn't a far leap from human to great ape. About 2% of our DNA. as a proportion it's not much, but given the fact that in a 10 point font, it fills a book twice the size of your standard dictionary, it still is an incredible amount. Some of which only dictates the difference between the tailless and tailed. But, I'm going off. Based on the "Similarity Concept," "Creator Form" idea, and "brain factor" from above, it would make sense that a) the creators were of a similar form to human kind, b) that the Unit would only be able to be used by some being who is of a similar structure ie chimps, apes and the like and c) that it would be nigh impossible for another like a dog or cat to use it.

Yet, this doesn't necessarily apply to the Zoanoid process, which can be "readily applied" to just about any kind of being you can imagine, given the proper time.

But, yet, at the same time it has been said "[t]he creators use the bio-booster armor in order to interact with the physical world since they do not possess phyical bodies. They evolved to the point where they no longer needed a physical body, so that is why they use the armor" on this board. This would mean that they were energy beings. Beings with no physical body, mostly life energy, EM energy, and the like, but could shape into a semi physical body. That is, the appearance of a true physical body, when in fact, there is nothing tangent there. However, based on that and the parts above it, perhaps they were bipedal prior to their evolution?

[*zeo]

We do not know that the Unit gave the creators humanoid form. We were never shown their physical form, only a mental impression of their existence and the fact is the unit would take on any form the host had. This is why the theories about them have been so wild.

And Guyver Zero was the first and only test on any life on Earth with bonding to the Creator's Unit.

Not to mention the Creators didn't start off developing humans, the dinosaurs were also part of their weapons development and they stayed along for that path for far longer than they did developing humans.

So we have no idea what they looked like or what requirements if any they had for the form they were looking for. They just happened upon humans in the last part of the their project.

The Creator ships themselves show there was no need for physical limbs at all since everything responded to their will and within the Relic one could simply float anywhere they wanted to go.

So any assumption of their physical form is just assumption.

The idea they are energy beings is also assumption and a wrong one since we know that during Guyver Zero's attack some of them died and that would not have happened unless they had a physical form that could be effected. Also energy beings need an environment in order to contain their energy which the Relics do not provide.

[Thunder Demon1472669266]

We do not know that the Unit gave the creators humanoid form. We were never shown their physical form, only a mental impression of their existence and the fact is the unit would take on any form the host had. This is why the theories about them have been so wild.

...

The idea they are energy beings is also assumption and a wrong one since we know that during Guyver Zero's attack some of them died and that would not have happened unless they had a physical form that could be effected. Also energy beings need an environment in order to contain their energy which the Relics do not provide.

But then, there is a reason that these are assumptions. However, sometimes a mental imprint and any artifacts left behind can give a general idea. Not an exact idea, but a general one. This all falls under Xenoarcheology, that is the study of ancient lifeforms not originating from Earth. Given that we have even less of an idea of what they look like without the imprint, there is much locked away we cannot see, simply because most pictures aren't 3D and we can't explore them like our own world.

But, you have to understand, even evolving to beyond the need for a physical body, does not mean they don't have one. It simply means that their mental abilities and capacities have expanded incredibly. But, this also does not mean their bodies are frail. To evolve beyond that physical form simply means that they understand their bodies and the way it works. It's similar here, though we don't know the whole story. Sometimes, not even the author knows everything about his/her world. Wild right? Not really. Look at it this way, they have a greater understanding of their minds, bodies, and spirits (if you believe such a thing). This also explains to a degree their vast scientific knowledge, and their technology for themselves, taking advantage of their strengths and making up for their weaknesses. It's exceedingly complex, but amazingly simple in principle.

[*zeo]

But, you have to understand, even evolving to beyond the need for a physical body, does not mean they don't have one.

No, actually it would since if they evolved beyond the need for a physical body then they wouldn't have one.

Beyond the fact you couldn't say they evolved beyond the need for a physical body unless they had already given up the body. (It's the only way "Beyond" would become a valid term)

Conservation of energy also applies to evolution and physical bodies, it takes energy to maintain a body and if there is no need for that body then evolution would simply drop it or reduce it to a vestigial of its former self.

The nature of the Guyver Unit itself and its need to bond to a host to give it form and function also shows that it would be illogical to assume the Creators did not have physical bodies. They would need physical bodies just to bond to the Units.

There is also no example of any Creator technology that doesn't deal with living technology and the manipulation of DNA.

So the only logical conclusion left is that they indeed had physical form, we were just never shown them.

[Thunder Demon1472669266]

But, to say that they don't have a body, and then say that needed a body to merge with a Unit, it's contradictory. It doesn't make sense. The Creators can't be entirely energy. But, I suppose, they could have a "body" of energy in an anthropomorphic way.

But, still...reading what you said straight through doesn't make sense. It's contradictory and makes little sense.

[*zeo]

Nothing I said was contradictory, if you really read what I said it would be plain to see I never said the Creators were made of energy. I said that was an assumption and explained how that assumption was wrong.

I just pointed out that the strangely common misconception that they are somehow evolved beyond physical form is not supported by what is shown in the manga.

It was pretty much the entire point of everything I have stated in this topic!

[Thunder Demon1472669266]

Oh. I see. Well, then. I stand corrected.