Feminist and MRA Hypocrisy. Why They Aren't Egalitarians

[Mirabilis]

 Well, as the saying goes, ladies first. This is ridiculous. I really can't believe that this political group has this kind of power, and that they still believe they're oppressed by the "patriarchy". 

 

[Mirabilis]

Here's an pretty good in depth look with regards to dress code and behavior in public with regards to what is tolerated and not tolerated among men and women.

 

[Mirabilis]

 It always gets me how both of these groups, men's Right Activists and Feminist claim to both be fighting for equality while refusing to assist the other group and focus entirely on their sexes or genders own issues. They nitpick each other, argue, shout and scream and cite statistics, until the whole dialogue just becomes a riot. They aren't egalitarians. They aren't fighting for equality, or equal treatment. They're both fighting for gender privilege and recognition. Both names start out as "Men's" and "Fem" so they're inherently sexist in their names. Sorry to bring up these issues, I'm not one to post that much about things like this honestly; but quite frankly this B.S. is getting out of control. I'm quite sick of having these things shoved down my throat, and told because I'm not a Feminist I oppress women. Get over it, I'm a true egalitarian not a pro-privilege movement. Likewise I'm told I'm in denial if I don't advocate for men's issues, I advocate for issues to be resolved for both genders, and for both genders to be held accountable on the same level.

 

This means, that with the justice system, no innocent little girl and don't be so hard on her. No. They're equal, treat her as a convict. Treat her as you would a male criminal. All these female teachers that have been sleeping with their students and doing sexual things, need to be treated as if they were male teachers. Not given a pass. Equal rights, equal treatment. Men should be allowed to express their sexuality and dress how they want to just like women can. No double standards, equality for all. Equal labor, equal pay for the same job. And so on.
 

[*Jess♥]

I can't really cover such a massive issue, I can only give my own thoughts of what is in my mind right now.

Men scare me. They are generally a lot stronger than me, heavier and also have more aggression and power. What I mean by that is, even if a man was smaller than me, if he came at me, I would still cower. I don't have the necessary aggression to defend myself. maybe aggression isn't the right word.
anyhow, the way I see it, if a woman was being sexually provocative, I would find that to be tantalising. but if it were a man, I would find it intimidating.

(yes I like both guys and girls.)

 

On the other hand, I want to point out that some behaviour by women is totally inappropriate. Miley Cyrus for example, makes me feel physically sick with her behaviour. Nikki Minaj too. Urgh.

[Mirabilis]

That's entirely my point as well. It's apart of the double standards. You see males aren't allowed to act vulgar, or express their sexuality the way women are allowed to and encouraged to do. If they do act vulgar in public they are often punished by being asked to leave, expelled from clubs, or even arrested depending on the situation and vulgarity. I can't tell you how many times I've heard girls brag about their bodies, and say things like "you got it show it off!" and they flaunt their bodies around to get attention, to tease guys and to get views. Yet, if a guy did anything like that, he'd be seen as a pervert and a disgusting pig. There's so many issues with the whole inequality and treatment of both genders so it's a difficult thing to deal with. But I would like to think we could start out with the basics, you know like decency and indecency. 

[*Jess♥]

but the point i was trying to make was that there is a different power dynamic because there is a actual difference in power.

men are generally stronger.
women are generally more vulnerable.

I think if we were to turn it around and look at a female body builder who was stronger than the majority of men, if she acted provocatively, I think people would feel unnerved by it.
 

[*Jess♥]

looking at this video made me think a bit more.

to me this video demonstrates a well balanced relationship between man and woman. I can empathise with the woman in the way the man is her keeper, her protector.

I think archetypically this is what most women want. It isn't true in all cases, but I think this is where the concept of consent comes in. in the type of relationship that I want, I would give consent to be 'kept' or 'looked after'. but of course in the past, consent wasn't sought by men. men took women as possessions and that is where feminism came from. feminism is a movement to remove the attitude that women are objects that can be owned.  it is a fight for a simple system of consent. I would think that would be pretty straightforward and basic common sense but there are still outdated thinking in some parts of society.

 

I think with regards to the provocative gesture... in most cases, women making provocative gestures, can assume implied consent, since most of the time, the men (and a few women) who are viewing the performance are looking for that kind of behaviour. at a hockey game though, people are not there to see a man behave provocatively. there is no implied consent in that situation.
I think this is also why Miley Cyrus got such a bad reaction from her inappropriate performance. it was a very public show with all sorts of people there. I think she assumed implied consent but was wrong to. a large majority of people viewing that performance did not consent to being shown such a 'performance'.

[H222G981]

Recently. Feminist have been protesting on how if its okay for men to go around without a shirt, than it should be okay for them too. I suppose I don't have a problem with that. 

 

 

Published on Aug 25, 2015

"Hundreds of bare-breasted women are expected to converge on a popular New Hampshire beach on Sunday to push for greater acceptance of topless sunbathing, much to the consternation of some local residents and officials.

The event at Hampton Beach was inspired by “Free the Nipple,†a 2014 documentary and a movement that seeks to “stand against female oppression and censorship, both in the United States and around the globe,†according to an online statement by its proponents.

 

Source: https://www.youtube.com/redirect?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rawstory.com%2F2015%2F08%2Fnew-hampshire-beach-overrun-by-topless-protesters-as-gawking-men-miss-the-point%2F&redir_token=tV-fOLjY319U8-DAI5O9zZX2bOt8MTQ0MDcwMDgxNUAxNDQwNjE0NDE1

 

Edited August 26, 2015 by Jupiter

[Mirabilis]

It gets me how these so called "activist" advocate for trivial things such as "free nipples" because: "I want to do what I want and I don't care if it offends anyone, and societies mean! Meeehhh!!!" When you have women who are being kidnapped, sold into sex slavery in India, the Middle East, heck even in the U.S. You have little girls being butchered in China, and little girls, babies, being tossed into ditches, and being kidnapped for forced marriage. Child marriage. Child abduction. Beating, killings, acid thrown on them for daring to advocate for equality and so many other things. Yet, no. We find it more important to "free nipples" or go nude, or breastfeed in peoples faces just to piss them off, and do what we want and cry "patriarchy!" when they don't get their way. That's more important than actually help women who are being murdered, tortured and killed for daring to speak up for the right and belief of equality and human rights. That tells you what American feminist find to be important. Hell that tells you what the whole west thinks is important. Sorry Jupiter, but this really runs deep in me. 

Edited August 27, 2015 by Mirabilis

[Gazham]

I wouldn't say it's acceptable for men or women to walk round with a top off, it's normally an act of vanity from what I see. Western culture has seemed to forget common decency in some ways, it's all more more more, I want I want. It's all lead to the decay of morals and society in turn. I think as and species we're still childish, these are still the days where we are collectively still learning how to act. I try and remember this when I get worked up over things like this. All we can do is educate the next generation and hope for the best.

[*Jess♥]

I think, the fact we always cover up our bodies, is the reason pornography exists.

if the naked body were an everyday sight, there would be less exploitation.

[Mirabilis]

That's interesting. Do you think if everyone walked around nude that people would no longer find any sort of sexual attraction or get sexually stimulated by seeing someone naked?

[Gazham]

If we did show more there would be decreased attraction I'm sure, the forbidden fruit scenario. But as soon as puberty hits (I can only speak for males), that might all go out of the window regardless.

[Mirabilis]

Got to love Karen. Her observations and videos are always thought provoking.

[*Jess♥]

sorry mirabilis, I missed your response.

 

just look at cultures in africa and south america etc who do not wear a lot of clothing. both men and women wear barely more than a loin cloth. their culture doesn't have pornography but to be fair, they don't have computers or printed media.

personally, I believe it is more a matter of behaviour.  if all women walked around without clothes on, then a man seeing a nude woman wouldn't identify that as a display of availability.  it would be the woman's behaviour that gives the messages. even being nude, there are certain parts that are not readily visible, but certain postures would reveal different shapes and forms. it is this, that would become provocative, and not the mere sight of bare skin.

pornography may still exist, but I believe there may be a different style of presentation. focusing on behaviour rather than presentation.

 

I had an interesting thought just now. it makes me think of the ferengi from star trek. "you force your women to wear clothes?!"
this is an interesting concept in the sense that in some society in some parallel universe, the men may force their women to wear clothes to create this sense that bare skin is something to prompt arousal.  it creates a sexual perversion of sorts.
hmm... maybe it's not a parallel universe.. i Just remembered how some arabian cultures and middle eastern cultures encourage women to wear burka and other things like that. to preserve the woman's mystery.

maybe this is the reason why there has been a large amount of sexual crimes in the uk perpetrated by people who came from those cultures. because UK women are not wearing full face veils and the men are overwhelmed.

[H222G981]

I've had the idea for a while that feminist may not just want equal rights, but special treatment as well. Don't get me wrong. I'm all for women getting what they deserve. But I've always felt that free the nipples is a silly idea. The idea that both men and women will be looked at sexually is inevitable.  If a woman with a nice body is going around with her tits hanging out. Somehow her rights aren't going to be violated by a teenager who pops a boner like most feminist think. The teen or man will exploit these women who go around because looking upon a woman's breasts is just either a natural male attraction or a turn on for the majority.

 

How can these women expect men not to look the other way? I myself have been put to the test by very attractive women when it comes to being attracted to someone and its hard to control your hormones when you're around that person and I don't mean that in the term of keeping your hands to yourself. I'm just saying a movement just based on Free the Nipples is very provoking to those out there and I have no doubts that most men would probably abuse it. Its because both male and female are genders and genders are as mother nature has it.....designed to be attracted to one another and to produce. So where do we draw the line?

Edited September 26, 2015 by Jupiter

[*Jess♥]

personally, I'm against the free the nipples campaign, I feel that area is just too personal.
For a male body, it's different. that area isn't as much of an erogenous zone on a male body.

[Mirabilis]

 I'm against it as well, as stated above, the female breast is indeed a sexual object; whether we want it to be or not. There are many examples that can be used to argue this. The stimulation a woman feels when it is massaged by their partners. How it erects when they are sexually excited, the fact that women use them to seduce their partners, or use them for sexual appeal. Strip clubs, plastic surgery to emphasize them. Just all sorts of examples. Breast are used in nature to attract mates, as breast show that they can feed the young. Same thing with the waists, showing on an instinctive level that they can bare children. 

Edited October 1, 2015 by Mirabilis

[Mirabilis]

A new video from Karen, this is astounding. I really can't even fathom this.

[river_chaos]

And people wonder why I have no faith in humanity.  "Free the nipples", seriously? How immature can these people get?!  I'm all for equal rights, but what these groups are doing is wrong.  I will never understand these people when so many other people in the world are suffering much worse than them. 

 

Personally, I don't like showing off skin.  I keep my chest area covered up along with my legs.  The only person I show off to is my boyfriend and no one else.  If another man makes a sexual remark, I'd either A) ignore him, or B) slap him if it warrants it.  To me, all the other girls that wear little to nothing like Miley Cyrus look like prostitutes.