The Guyver vs Tekkaman Blade

[odin]

Here is a Battle that is pretty interesting....a battle of Bioweapons, The Guyver Vs Tekkaman Blade, both are one of my favorite characters of all time and both share similar abilities. Each character gets all their respective powers and Power ups (they have to be canon to their respective series) and of course the battleground has to be neutral so it does not give any advantage to any side. who do you think would win? In my opinion the fight is pretty close although there is one defining factor about Blade that I think beats the Guyver: his defenses, Blade has been shown to withstand a Nuclear blast something I don't think the guyver is able to do at least on his base form, aside from that there is something else that could be the winning move for blade in theory, if you guys have seen the Tekkaman Blade series you would know that a Voltteker is basically Blades version of the Megasmasher and on the sequel Tekkaman Blade 2 you see blade being so powerful that he is able to absorb an enemy Voltteker and use his own to send it back via Crash Intrude, my theory is if Blade could do something like that then doing it to the megasmasher should not be Impossible, if he can't then I can only see him beating the guyver by out-speeding him which he is able to do by flying and crash intrude, sure the Guyver has Exceed but take note that the moves he does in that form that a while to do and against a fast opponent like blade time is something you don't have.

[*Jess♥]

i'm not certain about the ability of guyver to withstand a nuclear blast.

a directed and focused nuclear blast, ok sure he would probably not survive due to how we saw him get hit by a megasmasher blast.

but i think we need to consider that while the power of the megasmasher is compared to the power of a nuclear explosion, the megasmasher is focused into a beam, but a nuclear explosion is dispersed in all directions.

I think we need to consider the heat and the shockwave. over distance, the power of a nuclear explosion weakens due to the spreading out of it.

so how far are we putting the guyver from the epicentre?

what is the temperature in this location, what is the force of the blast hitting him?

do we have any information on what kind of impact the guyver can withstand?

[*Kenji Murakami]

Blade took one point-blank, and pretty much all it did was make him angry(er)

[odin]

Like Kenji said, Blade took one from point blank so I think we should put The Guyver in the center as well, although of course he could always go Gigantic and use barrier but I don't know if that would be strong enough to withstand it, I think it does but I'm just here trying to debate who would win if they ever thought each other, I mentioned the nuclear blast to stress how strong is blades defenses that could have an edge over Guyver 1, if anything the guyver has an advantage in versatility at least, he has many weapons to his disposal while Blade only has his tekk lance, his Volttekker and his blaster form. I had a discussion with Danny over facebook that the Guyver could use the Black Hole Cannon or the Gigasmasher, while I think that could do the job, it is a big IF cause from what I have seen both attacks need time to charge in order to use and against a Speedy character like Blade I doubt he will get the chance to use those without any outside help. What do you guys think? Is anybody here think the Guyver could win?

[*Jess♥]

most definitely would dude

just think about what the barrier is.

the barrier is the equivalent to a zoalords barrier.

even neo-zxtole could deflect the power of a megasmasher. khan survived a ballistic missile.

guyot took a direct hit with one side of a smasher when he wasn't even prepared. this is a focused beam.

the megasmasher is 100% of nuclear power in one beam.

even if the nuclear blast was point blank, the person only gets hit by half of that energy. just 3 feet away would result in getting hit by quarter of that energy. (or is it an eighth, this is 3d space after all)

so if the epicentre was less than 3 feet away from blade, then I would say he is withstanding the equivalent power of what guyot took in the fight with guyver 3 in the woods.

then we need to consider that archanfel took the power of 3 beams and even turned them around.

if gigantic was created to match archanfel, then his barrier could completely deflect the full 100% power of a nuclear blast?

edit:

but i need to stop myself here because i'm running off an assumption based on what somebody once said about the power of the megasmasher. in the VDF it states power output of 100 megawatts.

I'm currently trying to figure out how that compares.

[*Jess♥]

ok...

if we want to compare.

1 megaton nuclear warhead, has energy equivalent to 1162222 megawatt-hours.

that means to have an equal energy, the power output would need to be 1162222 megawatts for a full hour.

so even if the guyver could fire his megasmasher for an hour, he would be 11622 times weaker than a 1 megaton nuclear blast.

so wherever i heard that... (i think it was in the early 90s, maybe on the back of the video case or something)

it was WAY WRONG.

even the gigasmasher doesn't come close. at least in power output.

to compare if it has the same effect as a nuclear blast, we can work out what the equivalent power output would be if that same beam was fired in all directions. gigasmasher - 10,000MW. multiply by 360 then by 180.

648,000,000MW.

to get energy output we turn it into MWH. if it fires for a minute then the energy out put is the power output divided by 60.

that is 10,800,000MWhours. the equivalent megaton of 11 million megawatt hours is 9 megatons.

that is a rough estimate....

i mean some of my maths is very vague.

but in short, the gigasmasher is the equivalent of a nuclear blast in terms of the effect it has, but NOT the actual power output. and we are talking about being roughly 100 metres from the epicentre of the nuclear blast. point blank... there is no comparison.

so for anyone who get confused by my numbers and rambling..

tekkaman has insane defences compared to the guyver.

oh... I should probably add that megasmasher would have the equivalent effect as the warhead detonated above nagasaki (22 kiloton). the actual effect is probably greater than that of ground zero as teh epicentre was 400 metres above nagasaki, so the destructive power is likely greater than what actually hit the city.

[odin]

Wow, thanks for the analysis on the Megasmasher and Blade's defense against a nuclear blast Ryuki, it was very interesting. so by all of this even if the guyver managed to hit blade with a Gigasmasher he would probably shrug it off? looks like the fight is going more to Blades side so far although I would still hold him a threat against Blade even without the Smasher, there are the HF blades and the Gravity cannon as well as his huge reflexes and reaction time thanks to his sensors. There is also the black hole cannon but unless sho finds a way to shoot it faster than he does he wont be able to hit blade and that is a big if since Blade's armor is made to withstand the hazards of space in theory he should be able to escape the gravitational pull of a black hole, this is a theory of course, I'm trying to think of other ways that a guyver could be a threat to a Tekkaman.

edit: I'm not going to count the guyvers head beam cause Lisker used it against sho and it barely do a thing to him so by that extent it would just bounce off Blade, unless he used it to blind him or something which could work.

Edited October 13, 2012 by odin

[Jade Tatsu]

Not having watched Tekkaman for ... quite some time... I thought the healing of a Guyver would be far better than the Tekka-men. From what I remember damage to them seemed to be pretty permanent until they could rest and regenerate which wasn't necessarily quick.

The other 'weaknesses' I remember but I stand to be corrected is that the lance could be taken by someone else and their crystals were external to themselves, where as none of the Guyver's weapons can be removed, and the parasite is stored nice and safe in the boost dimension, there is no known way to cut the connection between the host and the parasite.

I have to ask, in which Tekkaman did Blade take that nuke? The original (1975) or one of the later ones? If someone could kindly answer that, I may or may not be able to make a case for the Guyver but it will depend on the answer.

[Guyver0]

Tekkaman Blade was the one who took the Nuclear Warhead at point blank.

[Jade Tatsu]

Now that I've read up, some of what i said previously should be dis-regarded since my memory is faulty

They really did massively over power the Tekkaman system. I think I like the Guyver system better. While Guyver may not win in a VoltTekka versus Megasmasher competition or in relative armor strength (has the strength of the Guyver Armor really been tested?) the Guyver does have a larger variety of weapons to call upon and I think much better spatial perception. I think the best bet would be to rely on the sonic weapons as those will damage things that usually are indestructible, especially if the frequencies are correct... Or put the Guyver into automatic. Or steal the lance.

But why are they fighting... they are both the good guys so wouldn't they be off having a beer?

[odin]

It's just a debate to see which system is the best and even if we don't pit Blade and 01 against each other they are not the only Guyver and Tekkamen out there I just put those 2 as an example since they are the ones that have unlocked most of their respective systems capabilities and all Tekkamen and Guyvers are essentially the same (with the exception of human made tekkaman and Guyver 2 F), so it could also be Tekkaman Evil vs Guyver 1 or Guyver 3 vs Tekkaman Dead end.

ps. you can't really steal a Tekk Lance since Blade has a whip like thing that he uses to retrieve the lance and as for the Tekk Crystal that weakness was exclusive to blade cause his was broken and had to rely on Pegas to transform but that weakness was fixed in Tekkaman Blade 2.

[Jade Tatsu]

You could steal the lance and yes, I read up a bit in the mean time about the crystals. I could have sworn I remembered them all being external but no matter.

Yes, I am aware of the retraction system Blade has for the lance but even though that is very strong, it could theoretically be cut and his own weapon would damage himself. Even if you just grabbed it while it's been retracted and rode it in. Yes he'd dodge but you control the angles and might be able to get in an attack.

Honestly though I don't think you can say that one system is 'better' than another. They were imagined by different people for different purposes and have been assigned different arbitrary strengths. I imagine if Guyver was to be released now, the strengths of the armour would be different because the author knows more as time goes on, or thinks other things would be more likely.

Purely strength to strength the Tekka system does seem to have the better defences and single 'brute force' attack but as has been said previously the Guyver has a greater variety of weapons and attacks that are based on differing principles which would give at least some opening and chance to attack. As I said previously I think the main bet would be on the sonic and vibration blades since regardless of how dense and protective armour is, sonic and vibration blades just don't attack in quite the same way as brute force.

[odin]

I don't think blade would fall for such an obvious tactic he is a martial artist and can clearly fight without his lance and is very cautious when using weapons, there was only one time his lance was stolen and he managed to fight without it and get it back, I don't know about the sonic attacks (they have not always worked on zoanoids, at least the Hyper ones or zoalords) but I do agree that the Vibration Blades could do something if he managed to keep Blade on the ground.

Even tho they are made by different people they have very similar capabilities thus why I wanted to do a comparison of each system to see how they would fair against each other and hear everyone opinion about it.

[*YoungGuyver]

It depends on composition of the armor, which we don't know about completely.

Tekka man armor may have greater thermal and radiation resistance (it is reflective of particles?), or it may be projecting an electromagnetic/zero point energy/anti-gravity shield. A neutrally charged object, such as a fist or frequency sword should be able to penetrate an EM shield. A gravity based pressure canon should be able to penetrate an anti-grav/zero point energy attack. The question then comes to the strength of the armor material itself. Is it elastic at all, can it absorb shocks? How strong are the molecular bonds? Are there any systems reinforcing it?

There are many questions to answer regarding this. The guyver's plethora of weapons give a higher chance of success at finding a weakness with Tekkaman. Though, since it is fictional we would need the author to reveal more about the composition and structure of the unit before any real speculation could be made. I don't know Tekkaman though, so I can't really estimate his stats for comparison

[*Jess♥]

I think a lot depends on 'location' though. I mean if this was in a manga penned by yoshiki takaya, then guyver would win. he has a larger degree of luck in that situation and no matter what blades power guyver possesses the necessary luck to get through and wipe the floor with him.

we've never been able to measure luck in the real world but in fictional stories it is an easily measurable force.

[Larz Zahn]

TekkamanBlade is pretty potent an all but im casting my vote for the guyver. I'm gonna venture a guess that the armor is more energy resistant than it is to actual physical attacks. Punches and sharp weapons still can damage a tekkaman. So the guyvers blade will be key in this battle. Then theres the gigantic blades. Longer range, able to control the blades like a whip or tentacle as well.

And for flight? I have to wonder if gigantic is faster than tekkaman when he uses the boosters.. Heck, if sho uses the gravity ram he kinda has his own crash intrude.

I'll admitt that in a straight up fist fight, then takaya would mop the floor with sho. After all sho has no combat training, well except trial an error. Lol.

Then theres the time. If its sho versus blade, then the fight will only last 30 minutes. did they fix this problem in tekkaman blade 2.

Hey ryuki, i love u breakin the megasmasher down to numbers. I always thought that 100 megawatts always sounded.... Lacking to what was actually shown. So heres my question if u dont mind me asking.

after seeing the actual power output for the mega smasher, would the actual effect still atomize people?

I suck at math lol.

[*Jess♥]

hey larz, I'm glad you appreciate it. I was worried i was going into a bit too much detail for people, and people might get bored to tears XD

ok, sure...

well let me give you a description I once read of the hiroshima incident.

The bomb was delivered by a US B29 bomber, nicknamed Enola Gay, from the Pacific island of Tinian. Dropped by parachute it exploded about 580 m. (1,885 ft.) above the ground, and at the point of detonation the temperature probably reached several million degrees centigrade. Almost immediately a fireball was created from which were emitted radiation and heat rays, and severe shock waves were created by the blast. A one-ton (900 kg.) conventional bomb would have destroyed all wooden structures within a radius of 40 m. (130 ft.)Little Boy destroyed them all within a radius of 2 km. (1.2 mi.) of the hypocentre (the point above which it exploded). The terrain was flat and congested with administrative and commercial buildings, and the radius of destruction for the many reinforced concrete structures was about 500 m. (1,625 ft.), though only the top stories of earthquake-resistant buildings were damage or destroyed. Altogether an area of 13 sq. km. (5 sq. mi.) was reduced to ashes and of the 76,000 buildings in the city 62.9% were destroyed and only 8% escaped damage.

Within 1.2 km. (.74 mi.) of the hypocentre there was probably a 50% death rate of the 350,000 people estimated to have been in Hiroshima at the time. Hiroshima City Survey Section estimated a figure of 118,661 civilian deaths up to 10 August 1946 (see Table). Add to this a probable figure of 20,000 deaths of military personnel and the current figure—for people are still dying as a result of the radiation received—is in the region of 140,000. Among those who survived, the long-term effects of radiation sickness, genetic and chromosome injury, and mental trauma have been catastrophic, even unborn children having been stunted in growth and sometimes mentally retarded.

most of the guyver targets are closer than 10m I reckon, so I would be confident that a regular creature would be easily obliterated by it.

edit: to help us all out with the idea of 100MW of power, I have obtained a quote from the following website :- http://cleantechnica.com/2012/09/08/100-mw-solar-power-plant-for-california-central-valley/

One source says this 100-MW solar plant will generate enough electricity to power 36,000 homes. However, the Consumer Energy Center says one megawatt is enough to power 1,000 homes. (It appears the source was using 360 homes per megawatt to calculate the total number of homes powered.)

just in case you got confused by the many youtube videos featuring a 100mW laser, that is 100mW and not 100MW.

mW = milliwatt = 0.001 watts

MW = megawatt = 1 000 000 watts

[Johnleprekan]

The voltekker is made up of a form of antimatter. Antimatter can completely annihilate matter when it comes into contact with it. I'm not sure how well a guyver can withstand that. We also don't know what the Guyver's megasmasher is composed of.

Tekkaman can definitely take damage when hit by physical weapons. In one episode, we see the humans shooting rifles with bullets made from spidercrab claws. Spidercrabs are generally a lot weaker than a Tekkaman.

Edited October 16, 2012 by Johnleprekan

[*Jess♥]

we do have clues about what the megasmasher actually fires.

the VDF says it gathers 'light' in the iris.

it is described as a particle canon.

however it works, it appears to tear apart whatever is in front of it.

it is possible that it is firing a beam of plasma.

edit:

some methods of creating a plasma include focusing high powered lasers to ionize the particles, this could be what we see happening in the smasher when charging. it also matches up to the description in the VDF.

looking at wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_weapon this article points us to particle beam http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Particle_beam so essentially what we could be looking at is the megasmasher is gathering a plasma by means of powerful lasers and then accelerating them as a particle beam?

sounds plausible to me.

[Guyver0]

If I remember correctly the particle energy is what is used as a "disruptive" to matter and is what breaks it down on the molecular level, but then the actual force from the smasher is what "erases" the matter, is that right?

If so wouldn't it mean that though the megasmasher and the voltekka are different, they both perform the same function which is wiping out all form of matter? So I would like to know if the two had a power struggle which of them would win or would they cancel each other out?

As for the fight itself, the Guyver's HF Swords, pressure cannon, and Sonic Buster are his Aces in the hole. The Tekk armor definitely beats out the Guyver bio-armor in terms of toughness, but not much can repel HF weapons and there is a chance that the pressure cannon may or may not work (depending) on where it hits. However the Guyver bio-armor can regenerate while the Tekk armor cannot and that can prove to be fatal to Tekkaman.

It terms of strength they seem to be very closely matched. If they were to get into a fist fight I would say Tekkaman would win if it is between D-Boy and Sho because of D-Boy's martial arts experience. However if it was between them and they were fully utilizing the powers beset to them than my money would be on Sho because over the years; Sho has become quite the battlefield strategist and has learned how to fully utilize the Guyver's powers/potential. Plus the Guyver does have the sensory orbs that alert him of danger while Tekkaman does not. However, the Guyver system eats a lot of energy very quickly which can be their downfall, unless it's like Tekkaman Blade with the 30 minute time limit that he may try to avoid and revert back.

Tekkaman however seems to only have the lancer as his main source of attack which can be dodged more easily than most attacks, plus how would it hold up to a HF sword struggle? Aside from certain blades that fire from the lancer and the Voltekka I cannot remember if Tekkaman has any other weapons or projectiles other than the energy whip he can use to get his lancer back.

All in all the battle would ultimately be decided by the host/wearer of the armor because though vastly different the two systems seem to offset each other's strong suites in one form or another. Although a fight between the Gigantic and Blaster Tekkaman I would love to see.

[*Jess♥]

If I remember correctly the particle energy is what is used as a "disruptive" to matter and is what breaks it down on the molecular level, but then the actual force from the smasher is what "erases" the matter, is that right?

I can't say whether that is right or wrong, I can only say that doesn't appear to be represented in the manga or the VDF.

If you're remembering past fan musings or fan theory, then I think it's best to forget about it and concentrate on what is in the manga as primary source and VDF as secondary.

unless it was with the tv series booklet? I don't have access to that so I can't check it. I'm not sure how reliable it would be either.

[Guyver0]

Thank you for responding Ryuki and I can't say for certain that I know either. All I can do is research on what exactly a particle beam cannon/weapon is and then make an educated assumption. I know wikipedia isn't the most reliable source for information, but none the less it is there to research and compare to concrete facts. Here are a couple sites that I think are worth looking at.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Particle_beam_weapon

http://www.airpower.maxwell.af.mil/airchronicles/aureview/1984/jul-aug/roberds.html

All that I can gather from the information provided; as a weapon the particle beams do break down objects on an atomic/subatomic or molecular level, but it doesn't say anything about the actual force of the cannon. Though I do think it is interesting that it mentions the usage of kinetic energy which is what the pressure cannon seems to rely on, combined with gravitational forces.