Religion = codified replacement for lost culture?

[*Jess♥]

http://tremault.wordpress.com/2013/03/25/religion-codified-replacement-for-lost-culture/

 

These days we see a lot of conversions to new religions and we see a lot of people following particular religions, but is this a sincere decision or do these people seem to pick and choose the religion that seems to offer the ‘best bits’?
 

There are many people who do discover a religion and it resonates with their soul, but how much of this is ‘finding the true god’ and how much of this is ‘finding the code that resonates with the self’?
In many ways, the person + religion marriage, says more about that person than it says about the religion, wouldn’t you agree? surely a person who was calm, methodical, liked the idea of reincarnation, liked to sit in silence… may be drawn more to Buddhism than to other religions? does this mean Buddhism is correct? or does it mean the person is a better fit for Buddhism?
 

In the modern world many people are finding themselves lost and direction-less. the communities of old have been disintegrated into this fast paced world where nobody knows their neighbour. I myself have lamented the fact that there is no community spirit around my neighbourhood. I only say hi to my neighbour in passing and I have few friends. I have found that in a church, there is.....  (read more in spoiler tag)

I have found that in a church, there is a sense of belonging. I think many people find this sense of belonging to be  powerful draw. Many people who regularly go to church, do not read or understand their holy book.  I do not call myself a Christian yet I understand more of the bible than a great majority of Christians that I meet. Now, my own personal situation, I do not call myself a Christian because I do not agree fully with the way This religion is practised. While I do agree with most of what the religion suggests, I do not limit myself to a label. Whatever ‘God’ may be, it is far more than can be encompassed by one set of codified beliefs bound by a small book.  Enough about that though, this is not about me.
 

So if many people choose a religion in order to feel like they belong to a society, then could they choose any? What of the past, of society and culture of days gone by? in many places in the world, there were always indigenous cultures and means of celebrating life that close-knit communities would share and have in common. Looking at places around the world where these communities still exist, we may see that the traditions of those cultures still survive. does this mean they have not ‘seen the light’ yet? or does it mean, they have no need for this new kind of society?
 

In our modern day world, where old cultures seem to be buried, people all around us, are searching for something. searching for a sense of belonging. Some manage to discover the original culture and spirituality and are labelled as ‘pagans’ and are labelled as unclean. The seemingly accepted method these days is to follow a major religion. it is seen as socially responsible. Could this be due to the actions of the early missionaries, labelling pagans as heathens, devil worshippers, those who are unclean?  It could be very likely. But this does not mean that these people of the past are correct. Our cultural taboos are shaped by atrocities of the past. only recently, homosexuality is becoming acceptable. it wasn’t for such a long time because of the actions of a certain law maker who condemned a homosexual to a very harsh punishment.  In much of the same way, it appears that the traditions of our ancestors are becoming more acceptable and more prevalent. I myself want to know more about my ancestors, and not so much about the ancestors of some middle eastern guys. What makes the middle eastern guys so special that only they can be give the path to heaven? nothing, that is what. If Christ showed himself to those people back then, then I strongly believe that Christ showed himself to my ancestors in some form too.  Personally, I am of the strong belief that ‘Christ’ does not equal ‘Jesus’. Jesus was a man. Christ is the word of God.  And we each have the word of God inside us.  If we did not, then it would be impossible for a person who does not know the Bible, to have morality.
 

Once again though, I am sharing my own beliefs. Well it is hard not to do that in a personal blog.
The question is this, if we have a society that was connected and where people have purpose; if we have a society where people do not feel a big ‘hole’ in their heart; would people seek religion?  Do people who are happy, accept the words of a person trying to ‘convert’ them? or is the only way to convert somebody who is happy, to torture them? What does history tell us? Where do most conversion happen? in places where people are said to be very happy, or in places where there is civil unrest? These are open questions and indeed my whole blog is an open question. I do not claim to have a conclusion that works for everybody. I just hope I have made some people think about this.

 

[*YoungGuyver]

A religion can be for many purposes.

Most people though do follow it just because they are sheep and it is what they are dictated to do.  The purpose comes for those that are not sheep, but that is for more than just religion.

 

Zoaraster took the religion he already had, and instead of the rich chiefs being the ones to live in heaven with the gods on account of their generosity with their people, he changed it to say that good/peaceful people would be living with the gods.  This was because chariots were introduced into his region, which spawned violent raids upon raids, and he wanted to bring the era of peace back.

 

Pathagorus saw no point in worshipping the gods anymore, as the universe seemed to exist despite the actions of men worshipping them.  He somehow believed enlightment could be found by studying pure mathematics, by understanding the universe.  (Thule, from the same time period, studied the Universe for the sake of the knowledge itself, and began the journey of science).

 

Confuscious saw people abandoning the old religioun where rites were performed by the emporer in order to maintain the cosmos.  People were abandoning self sacrifice/hyper propriety for strategy and self gain.  It was becoming a blood bath.  He taught the old ways and to live for someone else (manners of family) in order to bring peace.  He reinterpreted the old ways to find the wisdom they held.

 

The development of the Brahmins/yogas (they have too many titles) started with a fear of death, and performed rights to try and attain imortality.  The rites developed over time to force the practitioner to look inward and explore the self as a part of the universe.

 

The Isrealites started as a polytheistic society that in all likelihood rebelled from Cannan on grounds of corruption and crossed the Jordan into the wilderness, using metaphor to say they crossed the sea or reeds, and blamed Egypt as Egypt was the major trading partner/power of the time.  They were an insignificant kingdom that survived by making alliances.  They got a little arrogant at one point and thought they could beat Babylon, and ended up losing everything.  The priesthood of Yaweh wanted him to stand above all others and to be worshipped along, they got their wish.  The exiles rewrote a few things to help bring the exiles together as a people.  It's a bible filled with rewrites and borrows from other religions (this is a VERY narrow summary)

[*Jess♥]

I think it would be fun to chat with you over coffee some time.

You've done a lot of study i think we could have some great conversations.

[Aether]

i did write a different response to this at first but then i thought, ''did i actually address what you asked?'' i dont know but anyway, heres something a little different..

 

 

do a lot of people even care about religion nowadays??

if they want to 'belong' they seem to have to have a facebook accounts and twitter pages etc, massmedia has killed their brains and i dont think they give much thought to god or spirituality. they just live their lives and thats that, which in a way is fine, if thats their path.

but anyway....

on one hand organised religions have it the best because they have community spreading unity ( - however in reality there are many, many downsides to them and it also causes segragation at the same time.)

on the other hand (i would say) spirtualists have it better because they are actually more in tune to what i would believe god actually is ( and can happily intergrate with whoever and be happy as an individual.)

 

the down side  to it (if you want to call it that) is that it is more to do with the individuals relationship to god rather than a celebration with other people. its not to say like minded people cant get together but they 'worship' in a different way.

the only happy medium that springs to mind is in monastic communites where it is a mix of both, or maybe modern pagans that still revere nature through polytheism and pantheism and still live their daily lives in our 'normal' society.

i honestly would say scrap antiquated religions and start afresh. the real spirituality of religion (if you want to call it that) is always hidden anyway. Muslims have sufism, Judaism has kabbalah and Christianity has some form of gnosticism.


where would we start with a new religion though?? it would probably have to be scientific rather than spiritual to be excepted, and that is kind of contradictory.

'' Thanks be to zero point energy. Amen.''
 

[*YoungGuyver]

One of the first questions you are asked in Scientology is 'What laws have you broken?".  This is done in many religions.  There is a purpose.  It makes you feel guilty, and you automatically give power and authority to the people asking the question (it makes you easier to convert).  It's a psychological trick.  It's like Christianity telling us that we are all 'born with sin' and that we must seek forgivness (Which is blatantly stupid!  How can you be guilty before you've even done something!?)

 

You want a new religion?  Meditate and reflect on your life.  One what you have done today, and how you relate to others... reflect on everything in your meditations.  You don't need a god, or a creation story, or any mumbo jumbo.  You don't need a leader, or for it to even be a religion.

[*Jess♥]

I thought a little bit more about it today. I was thinking that when people turn to religion it can often be when a person feels they have completely lost control of their life and so they seek a leader to follow. they have given up being their own leader so they look to find a master. a lord. I believe it is a symptom of depression and thus why people say they find joy through religion. it is a kind of band-aid for the disease that is depression.

only in some cases.

_{of course in some cases, there is a sound and sane and healthy reason for believing something but lets not go into that now.}

So these people who wish to find a master, they look towards who would have in the past been a village chief, but there is no village chief. we have a very large society and transparency and our leaders are no longer revered figureheads. people are reluctant to take our leaders as their lord and master, so there are more people seeking this monotheistic type of religion.  to be led.

Humans are a social animal and caste systems are likely a natural component of our experience. I guess I don't totally get it because I have always been a natural leader, but I think through analysis I can understand the reasoning. I wonder though, does this mean there will always be those who need to be led? If this is the case, in our society, will be allow these people to be snatched up by religion, or would it be better for us to try and devise some form of secular tribe system?

I actually think this may be happening in some places. a sort of neo shamanism or neo paganism.

[Aether]

You want a new religion?  Meditate and reflect on your life.  One what you have done today, and how you relate to others... reflect on everything in your meditations.  You don't need a god, or a creation story, or any mumbo jumbo.  You don't need a leader, or for it to even be a religion.

 

no, i dont want a new religion. i dont need any religion.

 

i do meditate. youre preaching to the converted.

 

i was saying that the world needs a new 'religion'. because those that exsist - well definatelythe main 3 anyway, have done more harm than good, because as you said people give up their power and become sheep, and then of course there are the wars.

 

 

there are always those that will need to be led (spiritually or not ) simply because everyone is different. that then becomes a responsibilty of those leading. if the leader /chief is not a pure person then the community / tribe is in trouble from day one.

[*YoungGuyver]

There is also VMAT2 for consideration.  It is a gene that pumps a few chemicals around the brain.  Some speculate that it is responsible for people having transcendent experiences, allowing us to believe in them a little more.  Though more actual peer reviewed work needs to be done.

 

One hypothesis I have (note: I didn't say theory because I havn't tested it) is that people can be genetically suseptable to religion due to the need for a parental figure.  That when we are toddlers and such, we look to the security of our parents, and it gives us a feeling of love and safety.  As we grow older, we realize that mom and dad can't possibly shield us from every danger of the world... and so we look for an even more powerful parent.  My hypothesis is that we transfer what we used to think of parents unto a fictional entity with power that we ourselves would like.  We create so many gods.

 

Now how that would relate to VMAT2's regulation of serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine?  If VMAT2 actually has 'anything' to do with belief in god?

[Aether]

i thought VMAT2 was more to do with being more spiritually inclined than the norm, rather than having transcendental experiences??

on the parental thing , i see your reasoning for the hypothesis but i dont think you can ever put one theory on every person. Freud thought we all wanted to sleep with our own mothers and fathers -depending on your sex -- but i think that says more about him than the rest of us! and his work underpins all of modern psyciatry??

true, you could say the concept of God, therefore God is 'manmade',but is God really fictional?is a 'higher' power really fictional?? even if 'it' isnt a stereotypical manifestation of what we might think of God being, can you truly say there isnt something that exsists that made us and we are a part of that we cannot grasp? etc. etc.

whether the VMAT 2 has anything to do with it or not i believe that people experience God in their own way even if they are part of the same religion. lets face it there are evil people involved in religion, they can not possibily have a VMAT2 gene or be spiritually inclined - unless its to commune with evil spirits.

Also (if you beleieve in it) i think individual spiritual evolution plays a part in what you believe and or experience in a particular lifetime.

Edited March 29, 2013 by Aether

[*Jess♥]

I also want to say... I think there is a difference between the possibility of any 'god', the belief in the concept, and the need to worship a deity.

[*YoungGuyver]

Yes, I believe in the possibility of a god, and the possibility that there is no god.  I definitely do not think that an omnipotent omnicient god is choosing prophets to spread a message to all of mankind.  So I agree with Ryuki in the difference between possibility and belief.

 

And I think evil can be just as spiritual as good.  A Satanist can still believe in Jesus or Yaweh, he's just rooting for the other team.  (though I've heard that some satanists aren't really like that, but are rather protesting the absurdity of fundamentalists, or something such-it takes all kinds).  Hitler's troops had 'we march for god' inscribed on their belt buckles.  Evil can believe it is good aby convincing themselves that their victoms are the evil ones, and ignore the fact that they are causing pain and death unessessary for anyone's survival.