Power Level Ratios Part 3

[McAvoy]

Thanks to zeo, he saved this second attempt for me. It would have sucked to lose this as well.

Alright if anyone remembered, we were discussing the difference between the WG universe and GWoTG universe in terms of power levels. For example whether or not the standard Guyver is equal to each other in either universe. Now personally I think they are. But there is one problem is that in WG, a Guyver cannot get stronger on their own without getting a newer unit or getting an upgrade. Whereas Guyvers in GWotG can get stronger through physical training of the host's bodies.

Now some say this was stated in the case of Fighter Guyver, well remember it was stated once before that standard Guyvers can do this too. Now with Fighter Guyver someone said he could get stronger because he is afterall a True W'Kar unit. This is true, but remember that when W'Kar evolves he develops unique abilities and technologies. For example in W'Kar's 2nd or 3rd Evolution he had what was basically a normal Control Medal style, whereas if he was completely healed he would have a different Control Medal type. Fighter Guyver was more Guyver-like than his brother.

Second, W'Kar himself got stronger as well. Remember that for first ten years of his unit's activation he had the body of a 16 year old. So, when the Kregen aged him, it boosted his power by ~6% because of a bigger and more adult body.

Now, my last two posts on this subject also addressed Guyver Alkanphal of GWoTG vs. Warrior Alkanphel of WG. Alkanpha/els of either universe practically destroyed a small moon. We really do not know (I don't know either because I don't have that particular manga) the size of that moon that prwctically destroyed. He did like zeo stated stop the momentum of the small moon and destroyed all but a small part of it which got past him. If this is the 1 Ceres asteroid which is about 950 km in diameter (largest asteroid in the solar system) then it would have took a 85 teraton explosion of TNT to fragment it. BTW when I mean fragment, I mean pieces no larger than a meter in diameter. If it was the 4 Vesta which is 530 km in diameter, it would take about 14 teratons to vaporize it.

Of course the most extreme would be something the size of the moon itself, which it would take 4,200 teratons to fragment it.

But of course Albass's old datafile states that her attack is 150x a mega smasher. She is stated to be even stronger than Guyver Alkanphal. She is only a 28x to 34x character while WG's Alkanphel is a 40x character. Guyver Alkanphal's bio level was stated a few times be in 36,000 range as well. Assuming that Alkanphe/al of both univeres can produce a maximum of a 100 teratons, and Albass's 150x figure is correct. It would mean that a standard Guyver's mega smashers alone are equal to 666 gigatons each, whereas WG's standard Guyvers can produce only 500 tons. Over a billion times more powerful. So what do you think?

[jedi-guyver]

My thought would be that the gigantic guyver still has a lot more to show us if it is supposed to be able o go up against alk.

[*zeo]

Well, remember Alkanphel is dying so he may not be capable of using anywhere near his original maximum power. Also the Giga Smashers are 100x a normal Smashers and all that energy is focused into a single directional blast that is far more likely to penetrate his defenses. Plus the two Guyvers can tag team to hit him at least twice with the Giga Smashers.

As to the moon, it was spherical looking like our own moon which suggests it was large enough during its formation for its own gravity to effect its shape. Otherwise it should have been mishapen like most asteroids.

A good online resource for calculating various factors are the online calculators on StarDestroyer.net

Here's some direct links:

Planetary Parameter Calculator

Stellar Radiation Calculator

Relativity Calculator

Asteroid Destruction Calculator

Nuclear Weapon Effects Calculator

Another thing to consider is Zoalords are capable of attacks far beyond their normal ability by using all their power all at once. Like Guyot using up all his gravity points to create a black hole. It is said if he had put enough energy into that attack he could have created a true black hole which would have destroyed the whole planet. And of course that means Guyot was powerful enough to destroy a moon himself. Along with Imakirum who can also create a black hole attack, though his energy reserves seem to be Greater than Guyot's since he wasn't completely exhausted by using that attack.

Similarly though the Gigantic Smashers use up so much energy that it causes the Gigantic to auto deactivate moments after firing a full discharge but the resulting attack is 100x a normal Smashers.

So it could be Alkanphel was once capable of a similar feat and focused all his power to produce an attack far beyond his normal power level.

A bit of clarification is that the 40x Alkanphel is only our estimate of a fully healed Alkanphel. The present Warrior Alkanphel is only about 32x but is expected to be fully healed eventually by the unit. So, so far only the Alkanphel in the Strange World fic has demonstrated the full 40x power, which made him powerful enough to take on Dreadnought.

The Alkanphel in GWOTG was never fully healed. We actually placed the present dying Alkanphel at somewhere just above 4x. Though he is still capable of some amazing feats, like when Imakirum was defeated by Gigantic Dark he piloted the Ark, which normally requires the power of all 12 Zoalords, all by himself and used its power to restore Imakirum's power. Though the strain did exhaust him.

So I would suggest not comparing to Alkanphels moon destroying attack since that attack could be far beyond any present characters ability.

[McAvoy]

That's also another issue too, is the Gigantics between the two universes. For instance GWoTG is a 2x character, while the older WG was 2x as well. But with the new Chronicles the Gigantic may well be a 4x character.

The Giga smashers in GWotG is defintely not 100x. Maybe if Allen ever comes back and does his own Chronicles, it'll be different then.

[Guyver XT]

As to the moon, it was spherical looking like our own moon which suggests it was large enough during its formation for its own gravity to effect its shape. Otherwise it should have been mishapen like most asteroids.

That is correct Zeo, however just being spherical does not mean it has to be near the size of our own moon. 1 Ceres is spherical, and relatively speaking, if the moon is an orange, it is the size of a cherry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1_Ceres

It is large enough to be pressed into a sphere, and is currently considered to be just over the smallest mass that can do so.

[*zeo]

Actually it does, neither Ceres nor any other asteroids form as smooth a spherical shape as our own moon because it takes a significant amount of mass for gravity to produce a spherical shape that would not be distorted by the object's movement and impacts with other objects as it is forming.

In fact Ceres is irregular shaped.

Btw, don't count on wiki for facts too much. It's not an official Encyclopedia, but rather just a collection of articles from people on the web. Many of the topics it covers were put up just for fun and as gags. The owner of the site already had to take down a page put up by someone that implicated someone in the Kennedy assassination that had nothing to do with it.

So the information on wiki is only as accurate as the knowledge and intent of the person who put up the information in the first place.

[Guyver XT]

You are correct Zeo, in that Ceres is not 'A smooth ball' in the same fashion as our moon. However, my point is that just being spherical does not neccesitate being the size of our moon.

I would agree if visually it is rendered to look a lot like our moon that chances are it is a very massive object. this does not however require it be the size of our moon. My reference to Ceres was to show only the theoretical minimum mass neccesary to form a spherical object. If we are intent on a lunar surfaced object, I submit Dion a moon of Saturn.

Dion is significantly smaller then our moon, yet shares the same characteristics and surface features.

The visual comparison here is useful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moons

As are the close ups of Dion for reference.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dione_%28moon%29

I use Wikipedia for reference because it is the simplest material to reference quickly, since I'm not scanning my Astronomy text books. If you have a dispute with any specific information I am referencing let me know. Unless Dione was implicated in the Kennedy Assassination entry you previously mentioned, I beleive this information to be factual enough for this exercise.

[*zeo]

Wiki may be quick and convienant but the facts are only as accurate as the person who put them up.

I don't really object to you using them but you should access other sources to back it up every now and then just to be sure.

The fact remains however that a mass needs to be fairly significant before it can form a sphere without outside help. Ceres may be roughly circular but can hardly be called a sphere.

Ceres is also not a moon but an asteroid and as such it does not have the mass needed for its gravity to have significantly effected its formation. With a radius of only 466 km.

Dione is far larger and denser, denser than even its sister moons, with a radius of 566 km, which is still a third of the moon's 1,737.4 km radius.

So we're still talking about a really massive object and will take a lot more energy than it would take to destroy an asteroid.

[McAvoy]

Ok, just to put this back on topic.

Now most of us has read Meeting of the Warriors fic where both univeres came together. Now remember when W'Kar was explaining the Bio Levels and stated that Dreadnought had a BL of 26,655 which is 28x in his universe, but Dreadnought was really a 25x? Also, that MWG was 13x as well? But of course, BL's vary from standing still to using igh powered attacks.

Also, additionally, when the Creators fired a beam at Anubis, they read it as a BL of 100,000 which they stated was enough to destroy a full moon. Now anyone remember that Anubis also was hit by Albass's Ultimate Attack, it was the same outcome as Zeugma doing it to Guyver Zoalord. In both cases, it's almost the same. Guyver Zoalord was actually slightly weaker than Anubis, but so was Zeugma.

What shows the most is the battles between the two universes. The Dreadnought vs. W'Kar, WG2 vs. Jy-Taki, Dreadnought vs. Nano Xetel, Fighter Guyver vs. Warrior Kavzars, Dreadnought vs. Guyver Alkanphal, Zeus vs. Jy-Taki and so on.