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Maze247365

Who else is as strong as a Guyver?

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On 11/1/2018 at 12:54 PM, Tora Tan said:

guyver always seemed more grounded in reality though didn't it?  I realise it won't be perfect, but i think it has more consistency than most marvel comics.

Salkafar, I was really just hoping to suggest possibilities because I think it is easy to assume things but what if it is possible to have them weight so much when they are in human form. maybe metal in the bones can be stretched and changed easily? would it really be any different from calcium?  the aliens made some pretty crazy technology, like stuff that creates a guyver with their metallic crystal structures from seemingly organic materials. I think it could be reasonable that the way zoanoids are made is rather exotic too. 

a common mistake, the truth is that they are much stronger, leaving it clear, a gregol is a 15, and is capable of lifting about 50 tons, multiplying that by what would be a 100 leaving bace

a human bace according to the measurements of this universe after the conversion in zoanoid or guyver.

1 human = 3 tons
15 humans = 50 tons
100 humans = 300 tons,

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Abject nonsense.

It's an art error. That simple.

Gregole can't lift fifty tons.  Think: if Gregole is that strong, yet a Guyver can make mincemeat of one: how strong is a Guyver? There has never been any indication anywhere else that Zoanoids and Guyvers are that strong.

There has never been any indication ever at all that human beings are superhumanly strong in the Guyver universe, either. Perhaps a processed human has some enhanced strength, but three tons? Ridiculous.

Gregole has the equivalent strength of fifteen average, non-processed human beings with normal human strength, giving him the ability to lift one and a half to maybe two tons, ie, about ten to fourteen times his own body weight.

Edited by Salkafar

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I think it is safe to say that a gregole cannot lift a 50 ton tank.  That is why I was attempting to point out that the drawing that we have assumed is a gregole is not a gregole but more likely a tabross or just another zoanoid that looks similar. it is such a small drawing and very little detail and what details are there can be applied to a tabross, if we forgive a lack of tail? and we saw a tabross lifting a tank on xday the first time round anyway. The image that alkanfel linked for us after that, is not an official datafile for gregole, it's been pieced together by a fan.  the datafiles for gregole never show it lifting a tank. there are no official images showing gregole lifting a tank. just a small figure of a zoanoid that looks a lot like gregole but is probably a badly drawn tabross.

It may seem like we are wildly off topic but I think it is all relevant. I think it goes to show that we can expect some level of consistency from guyver. things that seem outlandish can surely be explained? like for example, cablarl in brain mode, can easily be constructed of a sponge like structure. it's highly likely that the structure and configuration is most important to amplify his powers. inside could be a lattice, like a radio tower or something.  I'd like to think that there is this sort of consistency and that it allows us to be able to make real world comparisons with them. well at least I'd rather think that way than just say it's all nonsense.

 

Edit:
I just wondered if it was a different tank from an abrams, because everyone seemed to just accept that it was an abrams, one of the heaviest tanks.  It seems light tanks can weight from as little as 6 tons. I did a google search for light tank and there are a lot of tanks that look like the one in the drawing.  So this could actually feasibly be a gregole lifting a light tank, or a gregole variant?
also, we can't see the back of the tank. there could be another zoanoid there or the tank could be resting on a small hill.

If a gregole can lift up to 7.5 tons normally... then if the centre of gravity of that tank was just behind him, and the rear was resting on a hill, then the weight of the tank could be 1.1 - 1.5 times his maximum strength? I'm just guessing here. it's possible that if this is gregole, it could be lifting something maybe up to 11 tons?  looking at a small diagram guessing the possible size and position of the ground and the outline of the tank and where the centre of gravity could be, I think it's possible

tank.jpg

Edited by Tora Tan

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On 11/3/2018 at 1:49 PM, Salkafar said:

Abject nonsense.

It's an art error. That simple.

Gregole can't lift fifty tons.  Think: if Gregole is that strong, yet a Guyver can make mincemeat of one: how strong is a Guyver? There has never been any indication anywhere else that Zoanoids and Guyvers are that strong.

There has never been any indication ever at all that human beings are superhumanly strong in the Guyver universe, either. Perhaps a processed human has some enhanced strength, but three tons? Ridiculous.

Gregole has the equivalent strength of fifteen average, non-processed human beings with normal human strength, giving him the ability to lift one and a half to maybe two tons, ie, about ten to fourteen times his own body weight.

 

19 hours ago, Tora Tan said:

I think it is safe to say that a gregole cannot lift a 50 ton tank.  That is why I was attempting to point out that the drawing that we have assumed is a gregole is not a gregole but more likely a tabross or just another zoanoid that looks similar. it is such a small drawing and very little detail and what details are there can be applied to a tabross, if we forgive a lack of tail? and we saw a tabross lifting a tank on xday the first time round anyway. The image that alkanfel linked for us after that, is not an official datafile for gregole, it's been pieced together by a fan.  the datafiles for gregole never show it lifting a tank. there are no official images showing gregole lifting a tank. just a small figure of a zoanoid that looks a lot like gregole but is probably a badly drawn tabross.

It may seem like we are wildly off topic but I think it is all relevant. I think it goes to show that we can expect some level of consistency from guyver. things that seem outlandish can surely be explained? like for example, cablarl in brain mode, can easily be constructed of a sponge like structure. it's highly likely that the structure and configuration is most important to amplify his powers. inside could be a lattice, like a radio tower or something.  I'd like to think that there is this sort of consistency and that it allows us to be able to make real world comparisons with them. well at least I'd rather think that way than just say it's all nonsense.

 

Edit:
I just wondered if it was a different tank from an abrams, because everyone seemed to just accept that it was an abrams, one of the heaviest tanks.  It seems light tanks can weight from as little as 6 tons. I did a google search for light tank and there are a lot of tanks that look like the one in the drawing.  So this could actually feasibly be a gregole lifting a light tank, or a gregole variant?
also, we can't see the back of the tank. there could be another zoanoid there or the tank could be resting on a small hill.

If a gregole can lift up to 7.5 tons normally... then if the centre of gravity of that tank was just behind him, and the rear was resting on a hill, then the weight of the tank could be 1.1 - 1.5 times his maximum strength? I'm just guessing here. it's possible that if this is gregole, it could be lifting something maybe up to 11 tons?  looking at a small diagram guessing the possible size and position of the ground and the outline of the tank and where the centre of gravity could be, I think it's possible

tank.jpg

I would like to clarify a couple of points.

First, we have never seen a zoanoid or a guyver in human form, facing a regular human so we can not know whether or not they have a difference in physical force. but we do have examples of zoalords, hyper zoanoids, and lost numbers in human form. demonstrating to have a human-like ferrous

second, by the date of publication and by the place where they were, it is deduced what type of tank they are, in fact they could investigate what kind of tanks were used at the beginning of the decade of the 90s, in the Middle East, the United States.

P.S. In the manga it is clear that a zoanoid with only one arm was starting to lift one of these tanks before being crushed by them.

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22 hours ago, alkanfel009 said:

second, by the date of publication and by the place where they were, it is deduced what type of tank they are, in fact they could investigate what kind of tanks were used at the beginning of the decade of the 90s, in the Middle East, the United States.

In the manga panels in book 9 that show tabross lifting a tank, we know what part of the world that is happening.  In the panel above with the diagram, there is no information saying where in the world that is. it could be anywhere, even some barren land near a tank museum or a military testing facility.
if it were the middle east, we would expect to see tabross.  and I can't imagine a gregole trying to lift a tank if they are in a place where tabross are deployed. it wouldn't be good military tactics. so I don't think that image is showing an active war zone where tanks would normally be deployed.
also, in that one picture is a single vamore. in book 9 and in the visualdatafile, lots of vamore were lined up in formation.  that seems to be their military tactic in the middle east, but here there is only one of them so I don't think it is the same place we saw in book 9.

Edited by Tora Tan

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11 hours ago, Tora Tan said:

In the manga panels in book 9 that show tabross lifting a tank, we know what part of the world that is happening.  In the panel above with the diagram, there is no information saying where in the world that is. it could be anywhere, even some barren land near a tank museum or a military testing facility.
if it were the middle east, we would expect to see tabross.  and I can't imagine a gregole trying to lift a tank if they are in a place where tabross are deployed. it wouldn't be good military tactics. so I don't think that image is showing an active war zone where tanks would normally be deployed.
also, in that one picture is a single vamore. in book 9 and in the visualdatafile, lots of vamore were lined up in formation.  that seems to be their military tactic in the middle east, but here there is only one of them so I don't think it is the same place we saw in book 9.

p_00012.jpg?u=

 

I see here. a zoanoid with only one arm that is starting to lift a tank.

p_00013.jpg?u=

p_00014.jpg?u=

Edited by alkanfel009

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yes, that is tabross. I don't think anyone is debating that.

tabross are developed for desert operations, their tail can take down an elephant, they are made for extreme strength and very likely designed specifically to take on tanks.  we don't have data on their strength level, but I think it's safe to assume it is more than 30. probably not over 9000 though, so I don't think a tabross could beat goku.

 

Edit:

zerbebuth was 45 times as powerful as a human, and at our current stage in the manga, Kronos has managed to not only reproduce him, but improve on his design. I think at the time of x-day a zoanoid with reasonable adoption  numbers, stronger than that was probably likely. in his datafile tabross does look more stronger built than zerbebuth, more like darzerb.

Edited by Tora Tan

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on a side note regarding a guyver's strength level versus what we seen, 

datafile has a guyver at 100x

a gregole at 15x

zerebubuth was 45x

and a derzerb was 60x.

 

ok we seen sho struggle with a gregole only once in the first issue. then dismembered the poor green giant.

 

zerebubuth was another matter. he pretty much ignored any physical blow in the 12 ova episodes. it took a double rear mule kick to the back of zerebubuths head to penetrate his armor. now that said, it could just be the armor, but my question is, did zerebubuth catch a punch from guyver?

 

and now there is derzerb. in the fight, he totally overpowered guyver. in the ova, when the unit was in control, the unit overpowered derzerb, again, it seemed to falter until the control medal shined and then he got stronger. then threw derzerb out a window. 

 

so in a normal situation fight,  a 60x derzerb was stronger than a 100x guyver.

 

is my math correct?

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Guyver 1 only struggled with a Gregole once, it was also only minutes after bonding for the first time. So it's questionable if it was even fully charged compared to how a Guyver is after being dormant in the boost dimension for awhile and then activated by a host (ref Sho's fight with the bats and Chaos Aptom). 

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